this is not going to happen again need a fix it plan thanks

[atles]

ok had a good day out on Saturday over to Tangalooma out of Redcliff a 30 nautical miles round trip

see larger:
http://www.elftown.com/stuff/tangalooma.jpg
Dolphins greeting us on arrival, of the bow of the boat
http://www.elftown.com/stuff/dolphin.jpg

well as always the bay wind and sea gets up in the afternoon
we were into the last hour and the sea was up to 1.2 m
I had all sails up pushing the boat at 5.1 knots so I was holding off reefing to try and get home
mistake number 1 left it too late
then the wind speed shot up to 20 knots waves 1.5 m
time to put on the life jackets, a +1 for us .
time to reef and put up a storm jib. got one of my teens to go up to the mast and lower the jib to put up the storm jib

as she did so she forgot to unravel the rope only unhooked it for the mast so off it went to the top of the mast opps
mistake number 2 not the best time for this to happen

the boat only had the main sail now but it did not have the power to push us though the waves time to drop the main and motor in
with a top speed of 5.2 knots on the motor this was going to get ugly.

as we got to the next port marker I had to put the boat beam on to the sea to get around and in to the bay .
now how best to handle waves on the beam in a investigator i am still working out but with 40 mins to get back in to the bay

i had time to play with angle and see what was bests i found the if you gave it a small amount of angle off the beam the wave would hit just under the cockpit floor lift the back of the boat and do a roll along the boat not the best but better than taking it beam on as this made a lot of my crew sea sick
and put the tiller under a lot of strain plus pushing the boat way over it cracked my till handle at which i had to wrap rope round to get us home
( if some one has one for sale pm me thanks )

so fix up time so the rope does not end up the mast again suggestion thanks .

[snoopebj]

Holy Moley one heck of an experience Atles.
I have no ideas other than what you did. I have found shallow lakes bays and offshore waters very treacherous in a blow creating a nasty chop.
In my limited experience
jackets and lifelines on
lower washboard pinned in
motor running for control
Lower all sails.
If your destination is across the line of waves go on the beam quarter as you did unless running out of sea room then turn into waves with full power and motor further out.
One very reassuring thing I have found with the I563 you can really feel the 50% ballast doing its work as you hang on to the pushpit and tiller for dear life.
Wonderful looking ocean up there btw

[Ozzie]

Hey atles, bad day , we all have them. I have done that myself on occasion. My personal solution was to get a piece of long electrical conduit I had laying around and tape a SS hook to the end of it and tie it with cable ties just outside the stanchions. Used it a few times to retreive lost halyards till i learned the maxim "wot gets clipped off gets clipped onto something else". I eventually dropped it ob retreiving a hat and have been meaning to replace it Another solution might be an old disused 3 piece beach rod with a hook that would store away but that would be clutter below.

I suppose the correct procedure (that I never follow) is to drop the jib then hank on the storm sail above it and them transfer the lines before unhanking the jib, but hey, there is no fun stories to be told and memories to be made if a days sailing is without hiccups

Most of Lake Mac is shallow and in crook weather you get used to the idea that you going to get hammered and get wet. The 563s keelboat performance is reassuring in such situations although it is generally not a pleasant ride. SIDE ISSUE for anyone who wears specs, a pair of industrial goggles over your specs is easier to wipe water off than your specs if in wet conditions. I picked that up from a sailing book yonks ago... used mine few times.

[Dr. Peter]

The first thing I am going to say is 'well done' for getting your family home safely. I think you already know what you did wrong and what went wrong so I am going to make just one suggestion:

After you had no headsail but a reef in your main you could have motor-sailed. We have done this many times and there are advantages:

1. You can sail closer to the wind - if you sheet the main right up
2. The boat is less likely to stop when 'punched' by a wave.
3. Having some sail up stabilizes the boat - less chance of seasickness.
4. You can pre-set the port-starboard angle on the outboard so that it helps the boat steer straight - less pressure on the rudder.

To assist in this my outboard mount has an extra low setting which helps keep the propeller submerged on the port tack. I also have anti-cavitation wings fitted.

Once again, well done on getting in OK.

[Yara50]

Atles,
I think you took on too much for a small boat in one day. For a long trip like that I would try to anchor for the night. In the sailing game it is never good to be trying to make a deadline. Too many things can go wrong.
I am surprised you broke your tiller. Was it a side force, or did you fall on it? Yara has a special design which holds the tiller up by friction, so that if I fall on it, it just moves down without breaking, and can be pulled back up.

The age old rule about reefing, is " the time to reef is the first time you think of doing it".
Same with a jib change, although halyard and downhaul led back to the cockpit does help.

For a jib change the classic racing technique which works for cruising too, is to first hank the new sail on between the bottom hanks of the sail you are currently flying, and then do a change of the halliard and sheets after lowering the flying jib . You can then unclip the old jib without losing anything overboard, and pass it back to the cockpit. On our boats it is not a good idea to use the forehatch for this, as you could ship a lot of water as the bow dips, especially if you have a crew person on the foredeck.

[Ozzie]

Ian , just a question on the sail replacement method. I can see the advantage when racing but if you are not racing and overcanvased and need to change down would it not be easier to drop the jib first to slow the boat and make the sail change while not driving hard into the waves. If changing from the genoa to the small jib this is what I do. Just interested in other's technique.

[Steve]

So far I have found in the winds I have sailed in It is a huge mistake to down size my headsail. I bring the boat under control via reefing the main. Any smaller sail than the current head sail I use I would then need another reef in the main or furl some sail on the boom when going to windward. Running off the wind a storm sail would be ok but why?. Sailing to windward with the storm jib up is a stuff up. The boat looses all speed and the weather helm is terrible, you are forever fighting it from rounding up and just about tearing the rudder off. Put that big jib back up, reef down the main and your off, driving forward as solid as . When the freo doctor comes in I never down size the jib

[Yara50]

Ozzie,
The technique I described avoids the need to go backwards and forwards to the foredeck, and helps stop loosing things overboard.

I am inclined to agree with Steve, that a first step of a deep reef of the mainsail could keep the boat balanced.

[atles]

thanks for all the help i am getting guys
i am not a vain man so when i get something wrong i like to get help from others which i am taking on board from you all !! and will use it all too !
this will improve my sailing.

now better clear some thing up,

when i was two hours in to my return trip i was driving in to the waves
which was good until i lost the jib line
the wind was at 20 knot sea 1.2 m that why i was going down to the storm jib then reefing main

in the last hour i had to go beam on to the sea to get to the next marker round the reef
this made is a lee shore the waves 1.5 still 20 knot winds trying to push me in to the reef not a nice feeling.

to stop getting hit side on i try to have a small amount of angle off the beam nearly having the wind and waves coming from behind.

the only other thing i found is that ever fifth or sixth wave was the one the push or lifted you the most
you did not have to look up to know it was coming the boat in between wave number four and five would slow the boat right down
from 5 knots to 3.6 knots then pick the boat up and push you along a 6.1 knots !

but at no time did i think the boat was going to broach. got to love the investigator
i am looking for the best sailing set up for both please.

[Ozzie]

Before I adopted the furler I would simply take the alternate jib forward after dropping the flying jib, swap them and then return . You definitely don't want multiple trips. If I did not have waves breaking on the deck I'd use the front hatch although obviously not recommended in crook weather.