INVESTIGATOR 563

I like both systems so I'll set up this weekend pending the weather because it's impossible to reposition my TS in the driveway so I'm governed by wind strength and direction when 'testing' the sails and rigging whilst parked in the driveway.

I've a stern mast support on my pushpit, however, it's not high enough for me to pick the mast up thus I need to get under the mast and lift to get it started... therefore:

A counterbalancing weight (CBW) system will 'hold' the mast at any height whilst I reposition myself to the cockpit seats to push the mast up another few feet or so and again, the CBW will hold the mast until I'm on the coach room and able to walk the mast to the full upright position. Then whilst the CBW holds the mast fully erect I can go forward to use a downhaul style system to tension the forestay.

or

I rig a gin pole (using jib halyard and mainsheet ) then the using the mainsheets, gin pole and jib halyard to haul the mast up using the cam cleats on the mainsail sheets as my stoppers. However, I can haul on the mainsheet from the pulpit area and use the same mainsail system to tension the forestay.

I think both systems are excellent and have merit and both require 'added' extras.
The CBW requires a boom (maybe the spinnaker pole secured at winch maybe not) off the trailer winch and a suitable counterweight
The mainsheet hauling system requires a gin pole (maybe the spinnaker pole secured at the mast maybe not) and the mainsheet used as the hauling device.

food for thought, so I'll try both and see how I go...
Cheers, Pete
I'm not 'yet' keen on mastmate Magic TP (it looks fantastic but at $499 without freight) it is expensive and looks like a whole lot of 'stuff'
I'm not 'yet' keen on mastmate SC because it looks like it's just an elastic strap (that's what it looks like to me in the video, plus the woman demonstrating is standing on the ground not the boat?) so that's an expensive strap at $169

Hi Pete

First thing I bought was a MastMate SC. Its not just a strap but a very strong spring loaded system sheaved in strong nylon (I think). I also bought the RollerMate (which you need for the winch strap) On my first attempt using the winch once the mastmate came into play and a couple more turns on the winch and the mast shot up into place (gave me a bit of a scare actually, maybe I should have taken David's advice and lifted the mast up the last few metres - which you can do with one hand) Lowering the mast is a bit more problematic - particularly if you do not follow David's advice.

I would also advise setting up some temporary BabyMates (which stop the mast moving sideways). You can set these up yourself.

I've also thought about using the MastMate in helping to winch in the Boat

For me, money well spent.

Regards Neil
Compass Rose

I was not really knocking the mast mate if anyone has got one . I am by nature a scavenger and i just think if you have stuff, hopefully free, that you can adapt to a purpose its often worth an experiment. My reason for thinking about using the fixed pole is because of just that... it is fixed. some of the ideas on mast lift seem to have a lot of moving bits and connections all of which have to be set up and connected and also become potential failure points. I was originally thinking about my counterweight pole going down inside the winch post till I realised its my tinnie trailer that had the open topped winch post, on the 563 the winch sits over the opening, then I thought of bolting the pole to the post then I realised there is a convenient jockey wheel clamp just sitting there waiting to do something else useful.

In regard to the mast mate could you not rig an equivalent by using some other form of coil spring (suitably shielded) with an override strop in case of failure. Tent spring, old motorbike coil spring, old car coil spring . remember these are all simply reducing the dead load to compensate for your muscles and back . Its basically a special effect to make you appear to be Arnie Schwartzeneger. I can with great personal difficulty raise my mast on my own from my mast prop. I think I could do it relatively easy if I could reduce the loading by say 30%.

I think .

Maybe.

I am about to test my setup this week and I'll post pics, either from me standing in the shadow of the raised mast or from the emergency ward at John Hunter Hospital

Pete, keep up the good work , we are all benefiting from your experiments and wish you well. You have got the forum percolating again

I have just finished rerigging during my current haulout . As I said I only raise masts occasionally but I figured the counterbalance method was worth a go, plus I was doing this in the privacy of my own driveway and so there was "no no" looney inventor spectacular at the ramp carpark. I recently added a heavy duty swing up jockey wheel for Spritzig II's trailer and as there is a fair bit of real estate vacant on the draw bar I left the old j.wheel clamp in place . I put an old round steel fence post I had scavenged in the clamp and a pulley hooked over the top rim attached a length of polypropylene rope to the mast and the other tied to a nylex tub to take my counterweight material. The pole was not as high as a would have liked but this was an experiment.

Now my original plan and ultimate plan was to use heavy stuff I already had on the boat ie two anchors and a full fuel tank , however as bad luck would have it the fuel tank was empty and both anchor shackles were frozen shut. So it was back to my original, original plan (see my first post ) water .

After running all my new rigging out and fitting plastic tubes over the shroud turnbuckles as per Jeff's on TSPs advice someway back and fixing the shrouds and the forestay to the rails and mast with my magic foam fingers ( large foam twist ties I have mentioned before) I was ready for a solo , snag free mast lift.

I filled the nylex cube with water from the hose to full, climbed up and the mast was still fairly weighty . I then added a couple of iron round flat weights and an antique iron scale balance I use as a doorstop in the study. All up I think the total was now about 20 kg, give or take a bit of scrape iron . I climbed up again and the mast was now much lighter. It was not bouncing like you see in the mast mate videos but was a comfortable lift for me with my stuffed back to the upright position . Even the "leap of faith" from the cockpit seat to the cabin roof was no drama. Only snag was that the cube touched the ground before the mast was fully upright but it was close enough to be past the herniated spinal disc zone. I looped some of the slack around the pulpit and had everything held in place to attach the forestay at my leisure . No fuss , no muss and no rough stuff.

Refinements would be, have a pretied loop in the poly to loop over the Sampson post when the mast is up or I'm sure with a bit of fiddling I could have the post higher so the cube drop would just get to the ground or stay above it when the mast is fully raised. But as an experiment it worked fine.

Now what to do with the pole. Wood would be lighter but I think light gauge steel square section with a round 2" section bolted to the end to fit the jockey clamp would work. This could be carried slid into two brackets on the trailer, but wait there's more.

Wotif you placed brackets on both sides of the trailer then added an L bracket to take an upright? When retrieving in in a cross wind or current, you can extend this square pole out with its upright to give you an extended goal post style guide (with foam covering on the upright) on the down wind side to keep your boat square to the trailer while winching on. One pole, two sets of brackets depending on the wind direction. Or if your touchy about your hull hitting the pole put it on the upwind side with your relocated pulley and pay out a stern line as you winch ( needs two hands ) .

Wotashame I'm moored .....all this trailer/ mast raising stuff is endless fun.

By the way I'm wondering if a modified rig could be used to raise the mast on the water . Two anchors on a rope through a roller mounted on the top of the pushpit. Hmmmmmmm